Extension302

Lillie Binder:

Hi. The first Ag Day was in 1975. So we're introducing the college up campus, kids to animals on the farm. You guys, Lillie and Christie. What farm animal are you scared of and why? Probably the beef cattle, because they don't like being socialized with people that much. So we were taught from square one, animal science, 101 to keep our distance and let them have their space less scared, more respectful of their boundaries. Respect is a good word. Yes.

Christy Mannering:

I'm going to branch off of Lillie's respect because my mom grew up with all kinds of animals and she told me a story about chickens that has terrified me further life and how you do not go interrupt chickens when they're with their babies and try to play with their babies because they will fly up and down you pecking. And so I am not going to get anywhere near chickens or their talents or their beak any time soon. I'm sure you're not alone.

Jake Jones:

There's a lot of people out there that have phobia of the chickens. Yeah, that's interesting. So as a kid, my mom told me a story. I don't remember this because I was too young, but I guess I was messing around near a pony and, you know, think of a pony would be that dangerous, but apparently she saved me from barely getting my face bit by one of these, these ponies that didn't like me and his space. So you gotta, you gotta respect those up. There's farming animals for sure. The last in-person ag day that we had was 2019. And I was there for that, had a really, really good time. And it's something that I look forward to every year. Can you tell us about the traditional ag day?

Lillie Binder:

So in a traditional year, we get to kind of bring together the best of what the college of agriculture has to offer and showcase a lot of what the community has to offer. We get a chance to bring in a lot of alumni who have their own businesses and have their own organizations that they get to highlight on ag day. For example, we usually get a free flying bird demonstration from Fung Lu, which is a really big draw for the community kids, especially because it's a really great way to kind of get acquainted with interacting with animals in like we were just talking about a very respectful way and kind of helping people understand, you know, helping people get better acquainted with animals and everything that the college of ag has to offer

Christy Mannering:

The traditional idea. Well, I have been fortunate to be part of 14 ag days and they have all been amazing. I think what I love most is that the students each year have such pride in showing off what they do and what their student organizations and programs are doing. And seeing them being able to show the community like, look, we're not just about cows and plows. We do all of this other research and we are passionate about it. And I agriculture science means something to the environment and there's a lot of people working on it. I, so I think the biggest part for me as an employee who's involved is to see the students really come up to bat and make it such an amazing event.

Lillie Binder:

Right? And I think one of the best parts is watching the students build off the faculty, the faculty, both off the community and the community kind of feeding off of that energy and everybody coming together to have a great ag day.

Jake Jones:

That was exactly how I remember it. And I love the usage of the word energy there because that's kind of what I remember feeling, you know, getting up there. I had to wake up at about five in the morning to get up there the last time, but it was just that energy that wakes you up. And no you're going to have a good day this year. And last year, both, we haven't been able to hold an in-person ag days. What does ag day gonna look like in 2021?

Christy Mannering:

Well, I am disappointed that we will not be in person again for the second year. So last year with the pandemic, we weren't unable to have ag day, even though we had planned it for months and months and months and trying to throw together something digital just wasn't going to happen. There were too many things up in the air. So this year I'm super excited that working with the students, we're able to bring everything online. My vision and Lillie can correct me if this isn't her vision is to just imagine that you're stepping on campus or walking towards Townsend hall. You see all the cars, you hear all the festivity, and you're going to be seeing the gardens. You can enter from all different areas. And you're going to be amazed at all of the tents and tables. And so we are going to be building a virtual environment that will have our so-called tents, each one labeled with research or extension or student organizations.

Christy Mannering:

And then inside those tents will be videos, which I'm my analogy is that those are the tables. So you would walk into a tent, you would walk up to a table and you would get your elevator pitch from whoever's at the table of, this is what we do here. This is what we're doing in the community. This is what our students are studying, or this is the research that's helping people in Sussex County or whatever it might be. And so the videos will be up to five minutes and they're going to be in a grid format. And underneath the videos, you'll see links to resources. So on a typical ag day, we would have 80 to 90 vendors. There are hopefully going to be maybe not 80 videos, but quite a bit of videos. I'm some that have been prerecorded by our videographer staff. Who's been amazing. So we'll have information about one health. We'll have information about what ag day is from our interim Dean, but really ag day is an opportunity to showcase what CANR means to the community. So hearing from the students directly hearing from researchers in their labs and hearing from people who work on the farm is going to be really important. And I think the virtual tents and, and video tables is going to be a great opportunity to learn and then repurpose that content leader. And I'm really excited to be able to watch it.

Jake Jones:

I think that's great that after having to take a year off, you guys came up with this great idea of how to keep that kind of tent and table view.

Lillie Binder:

I mean, I totally agree with everything Christy said, and I just really think this week, this year, well, it's a unique challenge in that everybody's getting very fatigued with all of the virtual things that we've had to get acquainted to in the past year. I think it's a good opportunity to kind of get everybody out of their shell and to get everybody excited about community event in whatever capacity we can get it done.

Dan Severson:

Virtual tent and table set up just sounds like an awful lot of work, but for the record, I'm going to tell you that the best ag day and the best ag president was back in 1994. So you guys got to top that one, your theme for this year is one world one health. Can you explain the idea that?

Christy Mannering:

Health is a triad concept? It's, it's going to show about the health of people, animals, plants, and how all of them are connected in a shared environment. And the students chose one world, one health as the theme, because it seems timely a timely way to highlight one of the college's unique strengths and it connects all of the departments of the college of agriculture and it connects the programs in cooperative extension. And if you think about it, agriculture is really the heart of one health. I mean, it truly represents an intersection of human health, environmental health, animal health, and as one of the unique strengths for the college we have such comprehensive research and so much outreach expertise through extension to develop a better understanding of this in Delaware, but really regionally and nationally and across the world. And so I think if you think about the COVID pandemic and think about one health under that lens, it's helping people to prepare should anything like this happening again. And then also making people think critically about how to respond. So one world, one health, it's the people, it includes policy and collaboration from agriculture sciences, and really to all sciences beyond that.

Lillie Binder:

I mean, I think one of the great things about incorporating one health is that while it's an integrated approach, it also kind of helps to show how there are ways to relate to it in any field you're in. And also like Christy said, it's, it's one of the main focuses of the college of ag. So I thought it was a great year to highlight it, especially because like she said, the themes involved with one health are incredibly poignant now. And I felt like it was one of the best ways to address the elephant in the room in a more proactive and less daunting way.

Jake Jones:

So it sounds like you guys have put a lot of effort and thought into providing those virtual tents and tables. And so who were some of the speakers and student organizations that are going to be Manning these tables and tents that ag day, this year, Lillie?

Lillie Binder:

Our keynote speaker is the 2021 Worrilow award winner, Sue Barton. And she'll be giving a talk called gardens are good for you. I think. And I thought that incorporating somebody who with expertise in kind of a site, an area of science that not a lot of people would probably think relates to one health is probably the best way to show how important it is and how it does touch every aspect, how it does touch so many different subjects and some of the, so some of the aspects of ag day that we'll be able to keep as similar to a normal year as possible are a lot of our demonstrations, like Christy said our videographer stuff has been going around and filming a lot of demonstrations that normally we would have been able to have in person, like for example, one of our entomology professors, Dr. Delaney, is going to be able to have a demonstration that she would normally give on ag day. We'll be having a milking demonstration from the animal science club and a sheep shearing demonstration from Larry Armstrong who works on web farm. In some ways it will be as close to a regular ag day as we could possibly get it. And in other ways, we'll have really new and exciting opportunities to get to know other aspects of the farm that would kind of be shut down for an ag.

Jake Jones:

College of agriculture and natural resources includes the students. Of course, the faculty and staff, and then there's cooperative extension kind of thrown in that umbrella too. Can you discuss how they all come together and can benefit the community in Delaware? And I know that's what ag week or ag day is kind of all about, but

Christy Mannering:

We are going to be working with the city of Newark. They're interested in putting together a video with resources from the city about different parks and environments in the city and green spaces. We're also going to be using coloring book pages from the Brandywine Conservancy and museum of art. They've allowed us to be able to link to different coloring pages they have about native plants, which really coincides with Dr. Barton, Sue Barton's talk about gardens are good for you and valuing a sense of place which is Thursday, April 22nd, by the way, at 6:00 PM. And I think that the environmental health safety group across the university will also be tuning in and providing us with the video. So there's the central UD components there and Newark as a city wanting to be involved. And then we have cooperative extension, which I really feel is like an umbrella unit.

Christy Mannering:

It is the college, every department that is in the college of agriculture is also part of cooperative extension. And the research that our faculty do sometimes doesn't make sense. I mean, to me, I'm a digital person, so I'm putting that research online, but I feel like I learned through us Moses when I'm listening to extension agents, because they take that research and they put it out into the community. They are the outreach into the community. So we have that component. And then we have the departments, entomology and wildlife ecology applied economics and statistics, plant soil, sciences, animal, and food sciences, all of those tie into one health really well. And all of them also have student organizations and clubs that are super passionate about the topics that they learn about. And we also have the UDBG Botanic garden that is right on campus, which people are normally able to walk through. But instead we'll have pictures. We have their virtual catalog for the plant sale that they usually have in person. And then of course we have the students, which the students are the CANR community. I mean, they are the future of agriculture science. They're the future of Delaware. So they're leading the way

Jake Jones:

Is this ag day and how can our listeners join this virtual table?

Lillie Binder:

Virtual ag day will, the website will be active from for the week of leading up to April 22nd, which is when Sue Barton's talk will be taking place in six to 7:00 PM. Every single day of that week, we'll be highlighting a different part of the website or a different demonstration or video that we think is particularly representative of the college of agriculture, natural resources.

Christy Mannering:

Just reiterate what Lillie said. It begins Monday, April 19th, and it will run through that week leading up to Saturday, April 24th, which is when Ag Day, would have been in person we're celebrating extra special with the live talk with Dr. Sue Barton on earth day, April 22nd. So each day, Monday through Saturday, we'll be highlighting different things. So we're very excited to launch the virtual tents, the video tables, and have everyone come in. So to speak to the browser window, pull up a seat, take a listen, and hopefully grab some really fun activities about bats and native plants for the kids and celebrate the whole week. So you have a webpage. I'm happy to tell you the address. It's

Jake Jones:

Very easy. Go right ahead.

Christy Mannering:

It's www.udel.edu/agday

Jake Jones:

Awesome. Well, we appreciate you guys joining us today. Lots of great information. And you know, like I said, in the face of adversity with the pandemic still going on and having to go virtual guys seem to have done

Christy Mannering:

A great job in getting this together. And what are some final thoughts you wanted to send to the listeners to make sure that they don't miss out on this year's ag day. I would like listeners to know that they can follow you the cooperative extension on social media and @UDCANR on social media and sign up for our newsletters through the website. Make sure you get those emails, make sure you're checking in on Twitter. You're checking in on Instagram and Facebook because that's where we'll be pushing out the material. And most importantly to say, thank you to Lillie and the students on the committee, because you know, some of them are seniors. This is their last year. Their last hurrah would have been really great to have them in person. And they're still putting in a lot of work and effort, and I'm really grateful to have them on the team.

Christy Mannering:

I would just say, I hope that people enjoy everything that we've been trying to put together. And, and that people feel as though this is as close to a regular ag days we could get for this year. And I hope that people do enjoy everything that we've put together. Absolutely. I have no doubt that it will be a great time. And then, you know, we also still have in the future, there will be ag day every year going forward. So don't miss it this year and then come back when we start having an it person again. It's well, yes, it's always the last Saturday of April. Mark it on your calendar and advance. Absolutely. So Dan and Jake, do you have any last things to add? No, Dan. Thank you!

Jenny Trunfio:

So I will say sour cream coffee cake. It is baked in a bread pan. It's the cake that all of my brothers, I have three older brothers, all of my brothers request for their birthday cake.

Kaitlin Klair:

I would say I probably have two. So we do homemade applesauce every year.

Dan Severson:

I love it.

Kaitlin Klair:

I grew up doing that with my grandmother and my aunt and my mom and I, my sister still carry that out every year. And then my second would have to be Great Grandmother's molasses cookies. They are really good. We don't make them as often as we should, but they are just one of those things where you just have to get the lard out and it's just like old home cooking food.

Dan Severson:

Yes.

Blake Moore:

So you're going to make some for us so we can sample it and then we can give you a review on the podcast the next time we do it. Is that kind of what's happening here?

Kaitlin Klair:

I can't, I have applesauce. I can give you applesauce. The molasses cookies, I will have to whip those up for you.

Blake Moore:

I don't know about you, Dan, but my mouth is watering right now. So yeah.

Dan Severson:

Yeah, the applesauce is to die for. I got some for Christmas. I think we met in the parking lot and I don't even think, one jar didn't even make it home.

Dan Severson:

Okay, we're here to talk about camping. And we had Doug Kraus on here talking about 4-H a while back, but give us a little recap about 4-H before we get into the 4-H camp.

Kaitlin Klair:

4-H is open to youth, boys and girls, anywhere between the ages of five and 19 years old. They take a project or multiple projects where they focus in anything from computer science, cooking, sewing, livestock projects, robotics, gardening. We have a wide variety of different projects.

Kaitlin Klair:

They can be active on a club level, a county level, a state level, and a national level. We give them options to go to national summits throughout the state. They go to National Congress where they get to meet different kids across the country, have those leadership interactions, and build the public speaking skills that they need, that they will take on into the workforce. Jenny, do you have anything to add?

Jenny Trunfio:

We also provide opportunities within the county to visit other states. We do an interstate exchange where our 4-H teams have the opportunity to visit another state for a week. They stay with 4-H'ers in another state, get to learn about 4-H there and about the state. And then the following year, those 4-H'ers stay with our 4-H'ers here in our state. So that's another opportunity for our older 4-H'ers.

Jake Jones:

Now that we know a little bit about 4-H can you guys explain the upcoming 4-H camps in Delaware?

Jenny Trunfio:

So we have multiple opportunities for youth to participate in 4-H camp. We have day camps and we have an overnight camp opportunity as well. I will talk about day camps a little bit, and then Kaitlin can talk about state camp.

Jenny Trunfio:

So our day camps are usually run a week long. We provide opportunities. First of all, our day camps are run by our 4-H teens. They are our counselors. They go through counselor training. So in New Castle County we have the Camp Counselor Club. It's called C3 for short. They start meeting in January and meet every month. And then they have a weekend, typically a weekend activity, in May where they get together and learn additional things. So during this camp counselor training, they are learning how to interact with youth, some behavior management styles and skills, and they also plan the day camp lessons and activities.

Jenny Trunfio:

So day camp itself runs a week long. During day camp we provide two or three classes each day, and usually the campers are in the same class every day. So they're developing additional skills over a longer period of time.

Jenny Trunfio:

We also then have programs where outside, whether they're people in other agricultural fields come in or health and nutrition areas, they'll come in and give presentations to our campers. And then we usually take a field trip, visit the pool, go swimming, have fun. All of our campers are put into people groups where they develop relationships with their people group leaders and each other. And the end of the week culminates with a council circle campfire. You know, it's during the day, so you have to use your imagination where they present songs, and skits, and yells, and work together to put on a show for their parents to see everything that they've learned for the week.

Kaitlin Klair:

So we also do a C.I.T. program, it's called Counselors In Training. So they come for a week and they learn a lot about leadership skills, how to plan a class, how to build those skills to teach in front of other kids, to build a lesson plan, the basic behavior management skills. So we work with them on that and how to react and not to react to different things. Which is a good learning skill that they can take on for when they go to college, workforce, all of those types of things.

Kaitlin Klair:

And then on the state level, we have two different state overnight camps. We have one that's called Environmental Camp. It is a three-day camp. It's short, it is for kids ages eight to 12 years old. It's a taste of going away from home. It's that age where kids are like, "Oh, I want to have sleepovers", but at the same time, they're not fully committed. They can get to try the sleepover away from mom and dad or meet new kids. It's environmental based, hence environmental camp. So we have people come from the DENIN school on UD campus, they're grad students, they come down and teach all of the classes. So they learn about water quality, different types of soils, all of those type of environmental science things.

Kaitlin Klair:

And then we also have a week long, it's called State 4-H Camp or Delaware 4-H State Camp. And that is held at camp Barnes every year. Last year was the first year we were virtual due to COVID and campers between the ages of 10 and 19 can come. And then we have a group of counselors. It's typically about a hundred campers to 15 to 20 counselors. And they stay in a cabin for a week long. We use eight to 10 cabins, two counselors in every cabin. They have a neutral bath house. They do classes throughout the day, have meals together, have rec time where they can play volleyball, go to the pool, go kayaking. And then every evening we have a counsel circle where they go down to the council circle and they sing songs and do skits. And it's a fun week long camp. A lot of kids look forward to that every year and it is a once in a lifetime experience for sure. And as Doug Crouse would say, "Once you drink the Kool-Aid you're addicted".

Jake Jones:

Well, thank you. I think Blake, Dan, and I are a little jealous that we're too old to attend these camps, but it sounds like very busy weeks, and you guys have a lot of moving parts.

Dan Severson:

Yeah, I'm going to echo what Jake said, and I was going to ask you guys, if you have any plans in the future of making state camp for 39 year olds. Just checking on that and see if that's in your wheelhouse somewhere. But yes. [crosstalk 00:08:01] Hey, I'd be all for it. I'd be your first...

Kaitlin Klair:

We have a lot of people interested. I can only imagine.

Jake Jones:

I imagine myself.

Blake Moore:

So this definitely sounds like a really impactful program for youth, and like you said, once in a lifetime, life changing experiences. So it's awesome that you guys are able to do that. So can you explain when is 4-H camp, typically during a normal year without COVID restrictions? When can people expect to hear about camps and when to sign up and then what are you planning for this coming year?

Kaitlin Klair:

For our statewide overnight camps, they are typically in June. For this year, the first week of camp is June 14th through the 19th, and the second week is June 21st through the 26th. Our environmental camp is usually the weekend before our first week of camp. So this year it will be June 11th through the 13th. It's a Friday, Saturday, Sunday type of event. Registration in a non-COVID year typically opens to 4-H members first as of March 1st, and then after March 15th, then we open it up to others outside of 4-H. It does fill up quickly, so anymore it typically doesn't get open to people who are non 4-H'ers, but environmental camp is one that non 4-H'ers can apply to as soon as it opens on March 1st. And then Jenny, if you want to talk about day camps.

Jenny Trunfio:

So in New Castle County, our day camp will be June 21st through the 25th. And then we have an animal science day camp, which is August 2nd through the 6th. Kent County, their day camp is July 5th through the 9th. And Sussex County has two different camps. Their first one is June 28th through July 2nd, and that is called an experience extension camp. And then they have one August 9th through the 13th. And for day camp, at least in New Castle County, we hope to open registration April 1st. However, due to the current health restrictions, we are in a holding pattern right now. Once we get permission to do in-person programming and have a better idea of where we are, we will advertise on our county webpage, on the extension calendar, once that opens.

Jake Jones:

Kaitlin, is this kind of the same way that state camp is right now?

Kaitlin Klair:

Yeah, so environmental and state are both... We're planning to open registration April 1st. And I think we're going to open registration regardless if we do have approval or not. And then we do have a letter out to all of the 4-H families across the state saying that we are pending in-person camp, if it gets approved by the University.

Dan Severson:

So guys with all this, changing health restrictions, where can people go to sign up for 4-H camp and find updated information as far as you know, in person virtual and changing dates and events? Where can they go to sign up and get more information on that?

Jenny Trunfio:

So our website is udel.edu/4-h. And that is the state website. From there, you can go to your county webpage. So there's Kent County, New Castle County, Sussex County. Once you click on that, there are tabs for camps and all of our updated information will be there. Once we open registration, the registration will be on the county page as well as on the University of Delaware events calendar.

Dan Severson:

Then the state page, the state 4-H page.

Jenny Trunfio:

Yes.

Kaitlin Klair:

Yes, and we'll also have it in all of our news blogs, our newsletters, you can find those located through the county for each page.

Dan Severson:

Yeah, and I imagine you guys would do a social media blast as well to get the word out.

Kaitlin Klair:

We will.

Dan Severson:

You guys cover all bases, I know that.

Jake Jones:

You've covered this a little bit, but can you walk us through again who can attend 4-H Camp, because from what I'm hearing, it's just about everyone.

Dan Severson:

Except for Blake.

Jake Jones:

Except for the three of us.

Kaitlin Klair:

So for environmental camp, you can attend if you're between the ages of eight and 12. For state camp, it's between the ages of 10 and 19. You can be a counselor if you're over the age of 19 or graduated high school, then you can be a counselor up until you're 23 years old. And then for day camp, we have three different types of day camps. Our Cloverbud day camp is for kids between the ages of five and seven. Our traditional day camp is between the ages of eight and 12. And then our C.I.T. day camp is between the ages of 13 to 15.

Jenny Trunfio:

I was going to say, and our older 4-H'ers are 13 year olds and up and have the opportunity to become counselors at our day camps. So you can be any 4-H'er, and even a little bit older than 4-H'ers, can be involved in our camps.

Blake Moore:

Also you covered this a little bit as well, and I know state camp is hosted at Camp Barnes, but where are some other locations that some of the day camps and environmental camps are run?

Jenny Trunfio:

I can say in the past, the New Castle County day camp has been held at Townsend Hall on campus. We may be looking for a new location for that. So if anyone has any thoughts on that, they can reach out to me. Kent County day camp is held at the Harrington Moose Lodge in Harrington, Delaware. The Sussex County camp, I believe the extension camp was held at the office.

Kaitlin Klair:

Yes. So the extension County camp is held at the office and then their traditional, just 4-H camp, is held at a church in Georgetown. I can't remember the exact name of the church, but it is in downtown Georgetown. And then for state camp and environmental camp this year, and in the few past years, they have both been held by Camp Barnes, and we have a great partnership with them where we are able to use their facilities for the first three weeks of the summer, two and a half weeks of the summer. So they let us use the facilities and we have a great relationship with them and we would not be able to hold camp there if we did not.

Jake Jones:

So the Sussex County office is the Carvel Research and Education Center? Is that what you're talking about?

Kaitlin Klair:

Yes.

Dan Severson:

All right. Blake, Jake, anything else or Kaitlin, Jen, any take home messages?

Kaitlin Klair:

If you're interested in joining 4-H or signing up for any of our camps, please visit our website. Like Jenny said, it's www.udel.edu/4-h. And we will be happy to set you up with a camp or a club or any questions you might have.

Dan Severson:

Yeah. Check it out early and often, as you know, we're in these changing health restrictions, so things can change fast.

Blake Moore:

I do have question and this for both Kaitlin and Jenny. Jenny, I know you said you attended 4-H camp in Pennsylvania, but still we'd like to hear an impactful experience you had as a camper when you were attending 4-H camp.

Kaitlin Klair:

My experience in 4-H and through camp actually led me to my job where I am today. It's where I got my passion for 4-H and the changes I saw my extension agent made through attending camp, and she used to be in charge of camp. And so the things that she did and the impact she had on my life and other people's life really encouraged me to become a 4-H agent, and that has been my goal since high school. So I'm really happy to be able to hopefully give that back to kids the same way that it was given to me when I was younger.

Dan Severson:

That's very nice and touching because I think 4-H people are a very special type of people.

Kaitlin Klair:

We're unique. We're very passionate about what we like.

Jenny Trunfio:

I grew up in 4-H in Pennsylvania. So my mother was an organizational leader and I have three older brothers and they were in 4-H. So when I started 4-H there were no such things as Cloverbuds, but my youngest brother is four years older than I am. So when he was in 4-H at eight years old, and I was four, I was going to 4-H meetings.

Jenny Trunfio:

So I learned everything from... I did show beef cattle when I was very young. So I learned everything from how to clip my Beef Shorthorn. His name was Silver. How to clip him, to prepare, to show, to how to plant my garden, to learn how to sew, and at camp, I would say my most impactful experiences at camp, were once I was able to become a counselor. At my camp was a little bit different. Our counselors were our teens. So kind of like our day camps, we were teen counselors.

Jenny Trunfio:

My most impactful experiences at camp were meeting those younger 4-H'ers, getting them to feel comfortable in their camp environment, those young eight year olds who were away from home for the first time, helping them to assimilate to the routines and learning how to do things and getting them involved in all of the activities. I would say that those were my most impactful experiences with 4-H camp.

Blake Moore:

That's awesome. And I really feel like you guys keep mentioning the experience about getting away from home and spending time away from home. My first time considerably away from home was basic training. And let me tell you, I would have liked to have a little bit of experience other than that, to lead up to that. Because it was a little bit of a process getting used to that type of thing. So it's great that you guys are able to provide that experience.

Dan Severson:

Thank you for your support, sir.

Jake Jones:

I want to say thank you to Jenny and Kaitlin. I think you guys are doing very important work, especially with COVID and the remote, how hard it is to maintain relationships for these kids. But I did want to ask, can someone explain what the four H's are in 4-H for me?

Kaitlin Klair:

Yes. So 4-H stands for head, heart, hands, and health. And so we try to encompass all four of those into everything we do.

Jenny Trunfio:

So it's head for clearer thinking, heart for greater loyalty, hands to larger service and health to better living. So those are the important parts of 4-H.

Dan Severson:

For my... [Crosstalk 00:18:06].

Kaitlin Klair:

My community.

Jenny Trunfio:

My community, my country, and my world.

Dan Severson:

It's unheated, it's still kind of same material, metal, tubing, plastic. What's the cost on those high tunnels? Is there cost shares available out there for people that were interested in high tunnels?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Yes there are cost shares available. Actually, if you visit your local NRCS offices, they are able to give you a whole lot about what there are. So the financial assistance is actually by, I mean, through the Environmental Quality Incentive Program, and it's still active even now. So anybody who is a farmer who would like to have a high tunnel on the ground can go to the NRCS offices, they can check whether they're eligible and they help cover part of the cost of the high tunnel.

Blake Moore:

What are some of the challenges and the advantages and disadvantages of growing in a high tunnel? Can you explain those?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Now, some of the advantages of growing in a high tunnel, remember I said that it's a covered structure. I would say that it develops [inaudible 00:03:55] season in that because it keeps heat inside. When the cold temperatures hit the ground, the high tunnels are still rather warm. So then, you know what? It extends the growing season. So you can have your crops growing longer than normal in the high tunnel. Now the high tunnel also can be used as a protector because it protects the crops, gives them shade, protects them from heat and sunscald. So some of the fruits that you really need them to look nice and not sunscalded, can be protected by the high tunnels. And that's why sometimes we get very good quality of tomatoes, for example, from high tunnels. Now, high tunnels can also, they support other materials like row covers, materials that can be used to protect crops from pests.

Like it's easier to use lures or traps in high tunnels. They lend themselves very well to some of the biological controls of the use of beneficial insects because there are enclosures. So, we would say that they are IPM friendly. You can easily practice IPM in the high tunnels. You can also have insects cream that can be integrated to exclude some of the insects, for example, the cucumber beetles. And that would also help you curb bacterial wilt. That means that high tunnels have the advantage of helping curb some of those diseases and pests. They're very versatile and you can grow anything in the high tunnel. Remember I told you that you can even have trees. There's a grower down Sussex County who grows cherry trees in high tunnels. So you can have small fruits growing in there, flowers, all kinds of vegetables. So another advantage of the high tunnels is that you can easily move them, especially, if consider crop rotation. If you have a moveable high tunnel in place, you can easily move it from ground to ground.

Although this also normally forms a disadvantage, especially if you can't move it from a location to the other. Because that means you have to keep using the same spot to grow crops over time. I would say high tunnels are great. People thought that they are a magic, you can perform some magic just using the high tunnel. Although over time you realize that they have certain problems too, but they are great. Most of these advantages outweigh the disadvantages. So growers really, really love the high tunnels. Because one of the things is that the small growers who actually grow their crops for sale can extend their season and they can have a quick return on their crops, especially if they use the right high tunnel. And then they grow the right crops and use the right principles. So, they can reap back their money really in good time because they always hit the market when people need the crops most.

Blake Moore:

It sounded like a lot of positives, very few negatives there. So thank you.

Jake Jones:

You mentioned the variety of crops that are grown in high tunnels. What's the most successful crops that you see growing in high tunnels here in Delaware?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Well, in Delaware, the number one crop and just like most of the neighboring state is tomatoes. Tomatoes are really a good high tunnel crop. Others are cucumber, lettuce and some pepper crops. And of course in the winter we have the carrots, the lettuce, and raspberries and blackberries are also picking up. So to answer your question, actually, tomatoes are the number one crop. Very popular.

Jake Jones:

And I know you mentioned that part of that is because of sun scarring and things like that, is moisture a factor in that as well? I know I have a problem growing tomatoes in my backyard because I get too much moisture on them. So does that help growing them in a high tunnel as well?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Yes. Moisture is a factor in... Remember that the high tunnels have coverings on them so, it doesn't rain in the high tunnel. So, you don't get that water coming directly in contact with the fruits. And then at the same time, tomatoes are also very sensitive when it comes to the amount of water that goes in the roots. In the high tunnel, you fertigate. So you can easily measure the amount of water that you release to the roots of the plant. So you don't get a lot of flooding unnecessarily. You can actually regulate the amount of water that the plants get.

Dan Severson:

Ain't that real good too. You were talking about high tunnels and how they extend the season. We're in February and it's cold. High tunnels can be used to start the season early. You were talking about tomatoes and stuff like that. What are some of the farmers doing right now? What are some of the planting dates or like rotations they could be doing to cover some of the disadvantages you were talking about as far as like you're planting the same ground over and over again, if you can't move your tunnel.

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

So right now I would say that growers who are using their high tunnels actually have some of the winter crops in there. Some of the crops that withstand the cold, like kohlrabi, I just visited a grower who had kohlrabi in his high tunnel. Crops like lettuces, crops like carrots. Carrots that are grown in the winter, they're really sweet. I don't know, they accumulate a lot of sugars, I guess, because of the long period of growth. So remember that around this time too, we have very limited life. So, growth of the crops is probably very slow even in the high tunnels, but for growers who really want to extend the season, they have the cool crops in the high tunnels. Now talking about the earliest time that you can start your crop through the high tunnels, that means that you're looking into the summer to start early.

For example, people who want to hit the market with the earliest tomatoes for summer, before the summer period, they have to start early. But at the same time, you remember that the temperatures are very altered. Some of the crops that we need to be early, like the tomatoes, actually cannot stand temperatures higher than, I mean, below 55°F when you're starting them. So, that means that you have to make sure that the soil temperatures are warm enough for you to start the early summer. So right now I would say farmers are mainly monitoring the ground temperatures. If they have plant directly, they're monitoring the ground temperatures and if the ground temperatures are higher than 65°F, then we know they can comfortably start planting.

And for tomatoes, I would say adequately 65°F. And that's why people, some of in the Sussex County even start earlier, their soils are sandy and they don't cool out as much. They heat up faster. So they can even start earlier. Talking about the rotations, the principles of rotation are just the same as any other vegetable production. Because you don't want to plant the same plant all through the season. So right now, probably some of the growers are having their high tunnels, lying fallow, or they have some cover crop in it awaiting for the major crop to come in, in the summer.

Jake Jones:

Dr. Ogutu, what is the best way to weed in a high tunnel? And I can ask you all of them at once, but basically what are the best production practices in a high tunnel? So weed, water fertilizing.

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

So weeding in a high tunnel... High tunnels normally they're enclosures and they're kind of are smaller in acreages compared to the field. You would say, well, it's just easy you go into a high tunnel and pull weeds, but at the same time you want to intensively use the space. So what happens in the high tunnel is mostly people use plastic covers. They made plastic and that helps to curb the weed especially around the plant. And then they also use a lot of mulches in the high tunnel. Now, the problem with some of the straw mulches is that they keep a lot of insects, right? And I've had that problem with the high tunnel so, that's why sometimes in the winter like this, you would like to just leave the... Open up the high tunnel so that you get the place as cold as possible to get rid of some of the pests. Or weeding, I would say that not too many people use herbicides in the high tunnels.

You'll probably find the little space, with plastic laid on the ground and then maybe mulches in between the plastic. So, that's normally the very common procedure when it comes to weeding. Now, when it comes to fertilizing, fertigation, the drip tape, they use the drip tape to irrigate the crop under the black plastic or whatever plastic they're using. So then that length the plants, it becomes easier for them to fertigate, to passing the fertilizer through the drip fly. But then, there is caution to that. Before you lay the plastic, you should probably amend your soil. You should amend your soil with adequate manure or whatever fertilizer that you want to put in before you lay, you put in the drip tape. Now this is because not all fertilizers can be put in through the drip tape.

So that's normally a challenge in the high tunnels, especially for people who live in places where the water is very alkaline. When the water is too alkaline, normally it blocks the emitters on the drip tape. That's one of the caveats that the high tunnel producers have to deal with. So for fertigation too, they use mostly the water soluble fertilizers, pass them through the drip line and one of the things to make sure that you don't do is to use maybe the fertilizers with salt, with high salt in because it doesn't rain in the high tunnel, you have salt accumulation in the soil, in the high tunnels. And this pretty much shows very fast in your crops, three or four years down the line, you see a lot of problems with saltation of the soil. And then a lot of burning across, I mean, on the edges of the leaves of plants. So that's also a challenge, but mostly fertigation, that is using the water soluble fertilizers and the drip line. And that helps a lot in the high tunnel.

Dan Severson:

So Jake, I thought one time we went down around Smyrna and we were looking at some strawberry plants in a high tunnel and come back and we thought it was a salt toxicity that was going through the strawberry plants because of like Rose was just saying, there's no rain to dissipate it.

Jake Jones:

Yeah. And it was, just like she described, it was like his fourth year with the cover on. So he hadn't had any rainfall and you could see the salt accumulation right on the edge of the leaves. I think that was like an easy diagnosis for us. And apparently it's common in the high tunnel. So, thank you Rose for pointing that out.

Blake Moore:

And what do you do to mitigate the salinity buildup there? Or to amend the soil to make sure that it doesn't affect the next crop?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Say mostly, kind of some rotation helps. For example, you would have to plant a crop that can use up that salt or the recommended practice is to remove the cover of the high tunnel and let it rain in it, or just to flood it with water. There's a way in which you flood the soil with water to kind of try and wash the salts into deeper layers in the ground. I would say that to mitigate the high salts, you probably need to change or rotate your crop so that you're not using the same fertilizer or the crop that you're using next is going to use up the, I mean, it's salt tolerant. And sometimes people even plant grafted crops, for example, a tomato farmer who doesn't have any other grounds to rotate plants, they would probably now still plant tomatoes, but use a rootstock that is more salt tolerant. Something that some growers elsewhere are already practicing.

Dan Severson:

And can you highlight some high tunnel projects that you're working on either at Delaware State University or regionally or maybe in partnership with the University of Delaware?

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Currently we are working on IPM or Integrated Pest Management in high tunnels. And we are looking into how we can use beneficial insects or some biologicals to kind of help us with the aphids, the whiteflies, spider mites that are a very big problem in the high tunnels. Now remembering the high tunnels because of the heat and the high humidity, some of these pests are really explosive. You can have them overwhelm you within a short time. So, we were trying to do that and trying to also include trap cropping together in the mix. Now for the trap cropping, we're trying to let the pests get onto a plant that is not economically important but it's kind of loved by the pest. So the pest can... It attracts the past better than the economical plant that you're growing.

For example, if you were growing cucumbers, for example. And then you had a problem with cucumber beetles, there are certain trap crops that are really, for example, Amaranthus. The cucumber beetle love Amaranthus. So they'd rather go and eat your Amaranthus than get onto the cucumber. So we are trying to incorporate trap crops inside the high tunnels so that we are able to kind of mitigate some of the pest problems. We're also trying to use some netting to exclude certain pests, but that depends on the size of the pest and we are doing that, making sure that we are not adding onto the ventilation problems of the high tunnel because it can really be humid in the high tunnel. We want to keep the ventilation going too.

Now, some of the projects that we had earlier on was strawberry production in the high tunnel, is still going on and we still have it some data going and we realized that for a strawberry grower to even be successful in growing in a high tunnel, you probably have to have all those varieties going, the late varieties, the early varieties so that you have as much production within the year, as much as possible. We've also done tomato production, which was our first project. And it's one that we've gotten into trellising the tomatoes, getting to demonstrate to the farmers the best way of trellising tomatoes, and even getting to show the growers the best varieties that grow in the high tunnels. Right now, the BHN series are very good for the high tunnels because they don't grow as tall. You can manage them pretty well in the high tunnel. Other projects were, like for the small-scale growers who were asking whether they could start some of the planting material in high tunnels, like Dan asked before, right now it's the winter and so what are the growers doing?

So sometimes you might want to start some of your plants in the high tunnel. For example, a potato grower, you might want to start some potato slips in the high tunnel, they will grow well and then by the time the late spring comes up, you have like vines to actually plant in the field. So instead of buying a whole lot of potatoes, potato vines to plant in the field, by the time the fields are ready, you can have your slips scattered in the high tunnel. And that was a really very successful project. So we continue having programs in our projects in our high tunnels. And it depends on some of the queries that the growers have.

Now, most of the growers who started their high tunnels about 10 years ago when we had our high tunnels erected at Smyrna Outreach Center now want to stop growing on the ground and maybe start growing on containers or even just put out some heat in the high tunnels. They want to move higher than from where they were, because when they got the high tunnels, they probably had NRCS fund them. And one of the requirements is that you only have to grow in the ground. So now we have our growers, they've already finished or they're already through with the three year requirement by the NRCS. They want to start looking into container production in the high tunnels and so forth. So we kind of growing with the growers, getting to where they want to be by asking us questions. And then we try to kind of carry out those projects in our high tunnels and have workshops around them and have them come over to see what's going on.

Ask about what we're doing with, yeah like UD. Yeah. I visited UD sometime back and I was really... They were taking care of the weeds in the high tunnels using solarization as a process. And that was really neat, instead of using herbicides or anything, if you're not planting anything in your high tunnel, and you want to get rid of the weeds, you probably solarize it. And that is just taking some polythene transparent polyethylene and then covering the high tunnel ground with it, and it helps really kill some of the soil fungi and bacteria as much as get rid of the weeds.

Blake Moore:

A lot of great work going on there. So we really appreciate that. And thank you for joining us talking about all this great work that you guys are working on.

Dan Severson:

Hey Dr. Ogutu, my grandma, she always had a garden and we always planted eggplants and it was like a bunker plant. That's where we always found the insects first. So we knew that we had issues. So it's funny my Nana knew that stuff way back when-

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Yeah. It's interesting that some of these things that we are touting, they're practices that they've been there for some time. It's only that we are now trying to just have them in the mainstream and recommend them to growers. But yeah, growers who've grown over time, they actually have the principles of growing at their fingertips.

Dan Severson:

A great presentation. Do you have any final words or thoughts or take home messages? And if you're willing to give out your contact information, if people want to reach out to you and get more information on high tunnels and how you can help them.

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Yeah well, my closing remarks, I would like to say that we at Delaware State University and Cooperative Extension at large, always work with growers to take care of their needs. And we also try to learn from them in a lot of ways. And for me working at Del State High Tunnels has been one of the major farming, I would say something that keeps me going. I've really liked working with high tunnels, and I really want to appreciate some of the high tunnel growers who've been very, very open into letting me use their high tunnel, letting me release biologicals in their high tunnels. And anytime that I want to take any temperature data, they help me, I mean, they allow me to put my HOBOs in there to track the temperatures and then I can go in anytime and download the data, that has been really helpful.

So I would say that high tunnels, as much as they are becoming popular, we've had a lot of other problems with them too. Some of the challenges, remember I talked about salt build up and then another thing is the structure itself. If you don't use the right strength of metal, have the right depths and have the structure really rooted and then have the sites that you have the high tunnel on, if the site is not right, I'm telling you, it will always be very devastating because most likely the winds are going to come and really tear up that plastic or rip the plastic or even bend the structure and so forth. We've had site problems going and I think that is one of the discouragements that has been there for the growers.

However, for a grower, a high tunnel grower to be successful in the first case, they really have to pinpoint a site that is very, I wouldn't say secluded, but a site that the wind is not going to rip out your high tunnel. The drainage is fine, you're growing very versatile by taking care of the soil quality because the soil drains well. So, and then of course when you were sourcing your high tunnel, you have to know where to do that. And the type of high tunnel you want to build and especially with respect to the type of crops you want to grow. It's very, very important because once you have all those things mailed down, then growing in the high tunnels is always a pleasure, it's always a pleasure and it's very rewarding. Okay. Now, for sources of... So, where would a grower or anybody get some information on high tunnels. So Cooperative Extension in various places have got very, very good projects going on with high tunnels.

One of the things that I encourage growers to do is to join some of the list CFAPs Of high tunnel growers. Now there's a list CFAP right from Kansas State and it contains a whole lot of farmers. In fact, almost all over the USA. And they're always talking about their experiences with high tunnels. And sometimes they ask questions and they have experts there asking them their questions. So if you join that list CFAP if you're a grower who really wants to know or learn from the fellow growers and join that list CFAP. We also have other universities that have been championing some research on high tunnels, Penn State, for example. I've had a lot of Penn State people come and talk in our workshop. So they have wonderful, wonderful projects on high tunnels. Otherwise, you can visit our website at Delaware State University, and that's desu.edu, the Cooperative Extension, and you'll be able to also get some of the stuff that we do here at DSU.

Dan Severson:

Blake, Jake, anything else you have to add?

Blake Moore:

Yes. Thank you very much. It seems like there's a lot of great information out there when I was doing research on this podcast. And it looks like you're connected to almost all of it. So I appreciate your work and effort in this and hope to learn more from you in the future.

Jake Jones:

Yeah. I just want to say thank you too, and I know how important high tunnels can be for beginning farmers and opportunities there, NRCS to help people get their businesses going. So I hope people learned a lot from this podcast. So thank you Dr. Ogutu.

Dan Severson:

Yes. Thank you Dr. Ogutu. And without our producers, we wouldn't be there to support them because we wouldn't have anybody to support. So thank you for our producers as well. Thank you. We'll call that a wrap.

Dr. Rose Ogutu:

Thank you so much.

Katie Young:

We hope you've enjoyed today's episode and will join us next time. In the meantime, visit us online at udel.edu/extension. Join our mailing list and join us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and YouTube at UD Extension. This program is brought to you by the University of Delaware Cooperative Extension, a service at the UD College of Agriculture and Natural Resources, a land grant institution. This institution is an equal opportunity provider.